Iran Interview: Ahmad Batebi "The Green Movement Goes Underground"

Persian2English have now published the third part of a recent interview with activist Ahmad Batebi, now living in exile in the US. The first two parts, “People’s Movement Will Stay Alive with Knowledge and Information” and  "The Green Movement and Mousavi" are already posted on EA:

Maryam: Everybody had high expectations for 11 February (22 Bahman). However, big demonstrations were not materialized. Security forces cracked down on a large scale. Why weren’t people able to protest similarly to Ashura (27 December) and Student Day (7 December)?

Batebi: As I mentioned, the more time that passes, the more immune the regime becomes [to protests], and they learn the ways to crackdown on and suppress the people. Yet, there were [still] several demonstrations.

One of the developments after the election was that the Ministry of Intelligence, which is the main security establishment, was not able to control people through its traditional methods and operations. This is when the Revolutionary Guards (IRGC) entered the scene. The IRGC practically took control of security operations and also took the Intelligence under its supervision. The IRGC operates much more ruthlessly- it beats and kills people.

We saw the events that unfolded on 27 December. One of the problems that the IRGC faced was that it had trusted the Ministry of Intelligence and had accepted the data and statistics that the Ministry had provided on the number of people who were or would be gathering in main squares. It had divided tasks and forces based on this data, which was somehow incorrect. Moreover, people had changed their strategy. Those who were leading people from outside Iran had planned to undo all the calculations, and the regime failed in controlling the people. This resulted in the IRGC acting more professionally the next time. It deployed much more forces and planned to take control on 11 February.

The Green Movement does not have [access to] radio, TV, or newspapers, and cannot spread the news and information like the Islamic Republic. The difference between 27 December and 11 February was that on Ashura, there were religious ceremonies held all over, so one could be anywhere in the city. People attended these ceremonies and, therefore, the movement was able to be everywhere. However, on 11 February , the routes [of the demonstrations] were predetermined. If the movement wanted to show itself it had to take these routes. [Security forces] had closed all the roads from the day before.

One of my friends who was in Iran said that he was with a friend who had a Basij membership card. They were going to attend the rally. He said, “We saw groups of Basijis who had come from Qom, Mashhad, etc. and they were not letting any of us in. The organization was so strong that strangers were not able to enter. The more we approached Azadi Square, the tighter the security became, and they stopped us before reaching the square. We told them we are Basijis. They asked us for the secret word.” This shows they had a password so no outsider would be able to enter.

Now the question is, why is it that the Green Movement could not succeed? [Regime forces] had organized way ahead of time. They had formed teams to prevent any outsider from joining the rally and they closed all the routes. When the ruling establishment is so powerful, this is the result. Before, people attended protests on 20-30 specific days and they were successful. On this one day, the people were not able to because of the regime’s organization. This was not due to the movement’s weakness, but it was because we did not have the same resources that the regime has at its disposal.

Maryam: After 11 February many supporters of the Iranian people’s movement in the West stepped aside. I do not want to say that we are witnessing a decline, but the situation is calming down. Why has this happened? Is it all because of 11 February?

Batebi: The outside world’s understanding of the movement is very different from what is happening inside Iran. The western world or the media think that movement means demonstrations, and if the latter doesn’t exist, nor does the former. However, we know that the culture of the Iranian people is different than that of the outside world. The fact that [the Iranian people] write slogans [on walls and banknotes] in the colour green and distribute cassettes and CD’s demonstrates that the movement is alive. The movement is learning how stay alive without incurring deaths and arrests. The movement is transferring from one form to another.

In all social movements across the world, you see that when a movement goes underground, for a very short period of time, the activists become slower. This is not sluggishness, but rather the period of transformation. We are passing through this phase. This time, when we have protests in June, we will have less people arrested, less people killed, and that is how people will learn. It is natural that the government learns how to suppress people and the people learn how to resist.



Maryam: You mean that the movement is going underground?

Batebi: Yes, it is, and it should. In the 1979 revolution, too, the movement became underground. That is why it succeeded.



Maryam: What do you say to the argument that western media does not focus on human rights [in Iran] and focuses more on the nuclear issue?

Batebi: Well, it is true, but we cannot tell the world to be the way we want it to be. The world is saying that this is my language and these are the issues I pay attention to. We cannot say, “Why do you pay attention to this issue [instead of the other one]?”  We have to see what they want to broadcast. Then we need to publish that and present it to the media in a package that follows [a specific] format.

The nuclear issue is the world’s concern. It is the concern of world governments, and this concern is reflected to the media from the top. The Iranian nuclear issue is important for the international community because it can endanger the world’s security. Governments pay attention to it and convey this concern to the media. However, the human rights issue is conveyed to the media from the bottom, and then the media can, in turn, convey it to the governments. We have to keep the media updated on all the instances of human rights abuses. We should send the media films, reports, translations [of the news], and articles. This will result in the media publishing and broadcasting [news on human rights issues in Iran]. Consequently, governments will pay attention.