Wednesday
Apr072010
US Military & Iraq's Civilians: The "Collateral Murder" Video (Full & Short Versions)
Wednesday, April 7, 2010 at 12:18
UPDATE 7 APRIL, 1118 GMT: We are adding the full, uncut 38-minute video of the incident . We do so after The Weekly Standard, trying to discredit WikiLeaks, put out the false story that the organisation had edited the video to distort the record of events, implying that the unedited version had been buried. The New York Times repeated the lie. (The full video has been available all the time on the "Collateral Murder" site.)
The US military says, "We're attempting to retrieve the video from the unit who did the investigation."
This is the abridged version of the video obtained by WikiLeaks and released at a press conference today. It claims to show the killing of civilians in Iraq by US military forces in 2007. Wikileaks' coverage also has interviews with families of the killed, supporting documents, and the full 38-minute video.
(Warning: Images are graphic.)
FULL VERSION
SHORT VERSION
The US military says, "We're attempting to retrieve the video from the unit who did the investigation."
This is the abridged version of the video obtained by WikiLeaks and released at a press conference today. It claims to show the killing of civilians in Iraq by US military forces in 2007. Wikileaks' coverage also has interviews with families of the killed, supporting documents, and the full 38-minute video.
(Warning: Images are graphic.)
FULL VERSION
SHORT VERSION
tagged New York Times, Weekly Standard, Wikileaks in Iraq
New York Times, Weekly Standard, Wikileaks in Iraq
Reader Comments (48)
Trully a war crime the US and those participating should be punished for. While this is war I still cannot think of a viable excuse for this to have happened. Regardless the one thing that did work was the US system which eventually released the video. Yes the military resisted but the checks and balances under the freedom of information act forced them to comply. With all sincerity does anyone honestly think a governement like Iran, Russia, or China would ever release footage as damning as this. The answer is no and it is why the US system does work. It works because at the end of the day more often than not those accountable will be brought to task. The one thing I did not like about the video was it obvious political message made through the messages(especially the leading one) and the splicing of footage. If wikileaks is supposed to be objective why the political angle?
My prayers go out for all the families of those who so lost their lives in this tragic horrific event. Words cannot even describe the grief and horror I felt realizing this was the sole responsibility of US forces. God help us all!
My God stop your whining ^
Mark,
"whining" Who is whining as you say? Please elaborate.
Thx
Bill
These soldiers are trained. They wield lethal force. And they choose an occupation with high risk, because they believe they are protecting something more valuable than their own lives.
On the ground, those foreigners had guns. Moments earlier, nearby, our troops had been fired on. That van was driving into a war zone.
Or: these soldiers are trained to be detached killers. They wield weapons paid for with your taxes. And they take risks because they don't highly value their own lives.
On the ground, the people who lived in the area had armed themselves. Enemy forces had opened fire there recently. That van driver could see a US Apache helicopter was protecting the now quiet scene.
Scott,
I think after you posted this and my comment we are going to be in for a rude awakening. Steel yourself because I have a sinking feeling our "nukem until they glow" T shirts are now going to be reclaimed!!!! Oh my I think we stepped over the line big time!!! :)
Thx
Bill
Dave,
All valid points and something I actually thought about. I just thought it prudent after watching the video to not bring it up realizing most know that already, accept it was wrong, and no matter how anyone tries to spin a defense it is not going to bring back the lives lost. Ironically it is these type of issues that also get me a bit pissed off because they will be rubbed in our faces all the while the wakos blow more people up each and every week! And, of course the bombings will be forgotten in about a week!!! Sort of a double standard but nothing is fair in war and we have to expect that we have to live up to a higher standard. Failure to live up to those standards just drags us down to the level of wakos!
Thx
Bill
I don't usually chime in but I watched the whole thing.
There are so many levels of wrong to this, and any equivalency to takfiris is a false one.
I care because we should be better than this. I have serious qualms with war, and know bad things happen, but this is cold-blooded murder.
This is a policy site, so most, including me, could point out all the problems and not-happening-ness of this, but my gut reaction is to hand these guys over to the Iraqis.
I'm not sure I really read you Bill, but I would say these things are definitely a nightmare to deal with. In any case it should be a learning experience not to have it done again, somehow.
This is about living in a more transparent society, where papers aren't shut down for reporting such things unfavorable to the government.
Bill- re checks and balances I think the US military actually turned down the FOI requests. The video was leaked- their site says "WikiLeaks obtained this video as well as supporting documents from a number of military whistleblowers".
Last night while watching it in total shock on TV I was hoping you'd put the video up here. I thought the full version might be a little longer, but I had no idea it was this long... and that more damning! The news presenters showing the video clearly distinguished between the shape and size of the objects (cameras) held by the Reuters journalists, and the much longer and thinner rifle held by a man later on in the footage, wondering why the pilots, who have so much experience in doing the same, couldn't tell the difference.
Those military whistle-blowers have a lot of guts. But I'm afraid American public opinion is too jaded by now - and too far from caring about events more than 6 months old - for this to make a big splash. Middle Eastern channels will be playing it over and over, though.
What really got to me was the way those pilots were practically foaming at the mouth, begging to be authorised to shoot up everything in sight. Of course, this is war and let's not kid ourselves it's all roses and niceities, but it really makes you wonder what the fuck the point of any of it is.
Catherine,
Not just Middle Eastern channels are showing it over and over; apparently so are the Taliban's outlets....
S.
[edited by moderator --- tangential to thread]
Dear All,
For the record, I wanted to post an exchange that took place on the Race for Iran board:
To my note "It was because of our concern over crimes that might be covered up that we supported Wikileaks’ efforts for months to release this video," two commenters --- one an official in the Iranian Foreign Ministry --- responded:
#1: These are not crimes, they are crimes against humanity that are being carried out on a regular basis even today. Your troubling double standards are what reveal you as an Orientalist.
#2: “Crimes that might be covered up”…How absurd. Did you mean crimes against humanity that have been covered up?
My reply:
“Reason, evidence, and logic” — since, gentlemen, you have chosen to substitute invective and chest-thumping polemic, let me help you.
Evidence: Within hours of Wikileaks revealing this video — a video we knew about for weeks and which we supported Wikileaks in disclosing — we posted it. We did so as a provider of news but we also did so as a long-time critic, in our analysis, of US foreign policy.
Reason: This is the definition under international law of “crimes against humanity”:
“Acts part either of a government policy (although the perpetrators need not identify themselves with this policy) or of a wide practice of atrocities tolerated or condoned by a government or a de facto authority. Murder; extermination; torture; rape and political, racial, or religious persecution and other inhumane acts reach the threshold of crimes against humanity only if they are part of a widespread or systematic practice. Isolated inhumane acts of this nature may constitute grave infringements of human rights, or depending on the circumstances, war crimes, but may fall short of falling into the category of crimes under discussion.”
It may well be that this action will be established as “part of a government policy or of a wide practice of atrocities tolerated or condoned by a government or a de facto authority”. I hope that it is considered and investigated as such, not by the US Government, but by an independent tribunal. I hope so, just as I supported a movement in 2003 trying to get referral of Britain to the International Criminal Court (the US, of course, is not a signatory) to try not only British actions in Afghanistan and Iraq but also de facto if not de jure, given Britain’s role as a “junior partner” in the conflict, US actions.
I will follow the process of what happens with this video and report on it responsibly as a journalist and as an analyst.
Logic: Try it sometime. Try it instead of resorting to a scare word like “orientalist”. Don’t cheapen “crimes of humanity” by tossing it around like a plaything because when you do, you discredit those — from all of those trying to ensure justice in Gaza to those untangling what happened in the Balkans in the 1990s to those seeking some resolution for the conflicts that have taken millions of lives in Africa to those defending the innocent, the slain, and the crippled in Iraq — who are diligently trying to ensure that the strongest possible case can and will be heard.
The funny thing is that we actually start out on the same side here — we all are repulsed by the wanton killing of civilians by military actions. But you apply a pre-condition: anyone who has dared provide news and analysis of Iran, and done so without following your lines of what is acceptable to report and argue, is to be lumped with your demons.
And that’s a pity.
Mike Dunn,
Thanks for the clarification. I read the wikileaks site a bit to fast and missed that fact. I guess we now know why the military was coming down on wikileaks so hard. However at least the backup system, the US press, kicked in and we now know the truth. One can only wonder how many more incidents like this have occured. The shameful part is this attemp at a coverup is only going to minimize any good the military had done. Everyone will fixate on this and ignore the countless examples of US soilders put their lives at risk to protect civilians. They should have just accepted they made a huge mistake and worked to repair the damage rather than sweep it under the carpet.
Thx
Bill
"These are not crimes, they are crimes against humanity that are being carried out on a regular basis even today. Your troubling double standards are what reveal you as an Orientalist." Typical response from an Islamist politician and to boot from Iran. What a hypocrite when his own country has raped, killed, and beaten its own citizens to stay in power. Just as predicted the fascists in the Islamic world will wield this like a sword(pun intended) to ply their trade against the "evil orientalist West" completely blind to the fact their crimes are no less worse. The sad part is this rhetoric politicizes the issue keeping it from ever being objectively reviewed by an indepedent body to ensure justice is handed down. Trully shameful those who will use this tragedgy to ply their political agenda.
Scott, I am presuming this was your reponse and if so it was a nice "punch" back in their face!!! By the way what were you expectign from Race from Iran anyway? They are regime favorites and thus this kind of response was to be expected.
Thx
Bill
Catherine,
Its top news here stateside as well. The lefties are foaming at the mouth over this. Sadly the issue is be politicized which will make it that much harder to make sure justice is found for those who lost their lives---Arggh this just pisses me off because the actual victims will get lost in this whole mess instead of being the focus! Regardless, believe me the American people are rightfully up in arms over this--the military is going to pay dear price for this cover up. I only hope those bent on destroying the US, the too wacky left, are not succesful because in the end of the day it is the military that keeps us safe for better or worse.
Thx
Bill
Bill,
I'm sure it will be (has been) top news in the US for a day or two - but how about a week after the story was widely reported? Will the April 14 Sunday talk shows even mention it? Maybe you can keep an eye on that. I'd be really curious to know.
About politicisng stories like these, frankly I don't know if there's any other way the American media/public/political factions these days (actually probably since the Vietnam war) would deal with this. The question is whether there will be justice for the victims and punishment for the perpetrators. If that can be achieved, I don't care if this crime is politicised six ways from Sunday (although I thoroughly share your distaste for those who make a political issue out of every blade of grass that grows the wrong way in their opinion).
Something is very confusing and does not add up here.
These helicopters are equipped with very sophisticated imaging technologies. The high power high resolution camera units installed in these helicopters can easily distinguish a weapon from reporter shoulder bag or camera. These high powered imaging systems have capabilities to transmit data (images) to the regional and/or to central command posts meaning the personnel in the command centers see what the pilot see in the battle field. We hear in the video the pilot is repeatedly requesting permission to engage that may indicate others are looking at the data transmitted from the aircraft. The delay in the” order to engage” tells me someone else is processing and assessing the image data. It may be hard to believe but these high power imaging systems that are fairly expensive (ranging from $40,000 to $300,000) are installed on these aircrafts to save lives- lives of both military personnel and civilians. These imaging systems can detect and see a mouse or a cricket moving on the ground.
Pilots and others who are monitoring ground activities are trained to process the image data so they can correctly identify and verify targets. Why then they make such a colossal error if this was one? Why would they look at a reporter shoulder bag and take that as a weapon? Were there any breakdown and if so where and how?
We hear reports of RPG but the images from the target area do not show any. Why? Does the video and audio are from the same incident?
Reporters in the war zone wear a visible press badge and permit issued by military. Reporters and photographers are required to obtain clearance to enter the battle zone. They are given and are required to wear bullet proof vest and helmet. The bullet proof vest has a unique color that clearly indentifies the person as a members of the press by military personnel on the ground and from the air. I do not see any of the men who are shot and killed wearing press vest. Why?
The van enters the area that appears not to be a traveled road- no other cars and no other person in that area. Why that van is that area? If the van happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, how is it possible that the driver and passengers did not hear the sound of gunfire as they were approaching that location? The people in the van get out of the van but do not survey the area instead they go directly to a wounded person. Why? Put yourself in their positions and let say you had loud music in the car and did not hear the gunfire as you approached that location. You arrive at a scene of massacre; there are several people shot dead and injured on the ground and you hear and see military helicopter above. You do not know the dead and injured people but you are a good samaritan and you want to help. You have your children in the car. What do you do? Do you do what the men in the van did? I know what I would do. I try to get help for the injured people without risking my loved ones in the car. People in that van did not do that. Why?
As Bill said we have checks and balances in place. This incident needs to be investigated by Congress to determine intentional and unintentional wrong doings. If this incident was the result of insufficient training in using and understating the technology and instruments at your disposable then more safeguards needs to be put in place to compensate for lack of or insufficient training. If it was the consequence of battle stress the responsibility lies with the commanders. If it was a callous act on the part of trigger happy soldiers then heads need to roll. If this was a set up to embarrass military commanders or policy makers then some people out to be tried for treason. If these men were enemies and not reporters and photographers then military needs to be exonerated.
Catherine,
“I’m afraid American public opinion is too jaded by now”
I am not sure about that. The war in Iraq will remain in front of our minds. We have paid heavy price both in blood and treasure. We have over 20,000 who have come home disfigured and disabled and we have to care for them. Over 4000 have come home in their coffins. We are mindful of Iraqis heavy losses. With the heavy heart we hope that at the end the history judge the effort as a noble one but we know that would be in a distant future, if ever.
Americans paid close attention to the war in Iraq and penalized the political party and elected officials who justified the war in Iraq. In the past couple of years anybody who got elected was elected by protest votes- meaning their only qualification was that they identified themselves as democrats. I think we went overboard with that punishment and in some cases we really shot ourselves in the foot.
Scott,
Can you add what time GNT you posted the 38-min version? That's to keep track of which comments/interpretations refer to which version.
Scott,
Can you add what time GMT you posted the 38-min version? That's to keep track of which comments/interpretations refer to which version.
Quoting Bill --
Catherine,
Its top news here stateside as well. The lefties are foaming at the mouth over this.
********
The Iraqis are doing the same thing.
Read what the Iraqis are doing to THEIR OWN PEOPLE.- http://www.virtueonline.org/portal/modules/news/article.php?storyid=12348
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swOva7B7FKI
Leftists take no notice of this. If the victims are Muslim, it's a crime against humanity. If the victims are Christian, it's not. This is how they think. They have same attitude with the crisis in Jos, Nigeria.
I am disturbed at the unrelenting attack on U.S. servicement who often show remarkable restraint.
On Dissected News this morning, I have an article written by an Iraq War veteran that clearly illustrates that this incident is a tragedy, but an understandable one given the circumstances.
Those helicopter pilots are in grave danger, as are the troops on the ground whom they are supporting, while fighting against an enemy that routinely breaks the Geneva convention and the rules of engagement.
Wikileaks was right to report this story, but to call the incident "murder," or to editorialize their reporting in the way that they did, undermines the journalism that needed to be done. Mr. Haddow's ignorance of war, and warriors, will be dismissed by anyone who knows the situation on the ground.
Believe me, I'm no Iraq War apologist, but the criticism of the pilots is unfair. This is a tragedy, and the incident should be studied, but pointing a camera at an attack helicopter in a combat situation is a dangerous business. It's easier to Monday morning quarterback.
Read the analysis of a war vet here: http://www.dissectednews.com/2010/04/wikileaks-monday-morning-quarterbacking.html
Sorry, the link to Mr. Haddow's article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/libertycentral/2010/apr/07/wikileaks-collateral-murder-iraq-video
Journalists and journalistically work were part of the war in Iraq. Can’t you remember the first pictures of the war? They looked like a “clinical intervention “- just like pyrotechnics detained at the end of the year. Even the “embedded journalists” weren’t save – especially the so called few”free journalists” often were targets. Many of them were murdered and shot by the different participants of the war. No doubt - in the war and in the aftermath the government wanted to disconnect the people from free covering. After 2004 Reuters engaged free local journalists – just endowed with hand cameras to take pictures.
The biggest scandal in this matter is that the US are refusing up to now being a member of the “International Criminal Court of the United Nations”. Being not a signatory is basis for this kind of crime.